Saturday, August 29, 2009

The BRIAN TINGLE Interview! A Bluesman Speaks!

I’ve been hit by a real case of the blues lately at The Realm and, friends, that’s a very good thing. Seems a nice selection of blues records has rolled thru the doors and into my famed listening emporium. Happy to say, they’ve all been good but one has stood out as the real keeper and that’s been the 2004 effort by BRIAN TINGLE & BLUE THUNDER entitled “Tryin’ To Make A Livin.’” After hearing this super-cool statement of musical intent, I felt compelled to get in touch with BRIAN and sit down with him to pick his brain about his band, album, current activities and much, much more. You’ll find in the extensive interview below that Mr. TINGLE is a man who’s paid his dues, been around and knows a helluva lot about not only the local blues scene but music in general. He shares his thoughts as honestly and forthrightly as anyone I’ve ever talked to. Read on, my friends. (BRIAN TINGLE seated in front in pic.)

RAY – The beginning is always a good place to start. Where was your’s, musically? How did you avoid being the guy who’s idea of “music” is turning on the radio on the way to work and becoming a player instead?

BRIAN - I’m not exactly sure how everything started for me. I mean, did I show interest first or did I get an instrument first? I don’t know. I started on piano actually, taking lessons at a very young age. I discovered drums next, so my parents got me a drum and this little “one man band” kit which had a tambourine, a harmonica, a slide whistle and last but not least, a “triangle.” I had no idea what to do with it except maybe to call everyone to a chuck wagon.

When I was 13 I got my first real drum set, a “Lido Supreme” 4 piece kit. I became fluent, jamming to records and playing with friends, then when I was about14 or 15 a school friend taught me a chord on the guitar during music class. H taught me the chords to “Norwegian Wood” and played the melody over top of it. I thought this was the coolest thing I had heard and started teaching myself to play by listening to records over and over again.

I picked up a bass guitar because my neighbors basement band needed somebody. They had a guitar player, so I played bass because I really wanted to play. Later on and for years to come I played all these instruments professionally.

RAY – Who influenced your playing? Who inspires you now?

BRIAN – Early on it was a variety I guess. I liked The Beatles’ guitar stuff. Aerosmith, Brad and Joe. Kerry Livgren from Kansas. I’d have to say that Ace Frehley from Kiss was my favorite as well as Paul Stanley. Jimmy Page is probably the greatest all round guitar player I’ve studied. However, I did not start really listening to him and the other British guys until around 17 or so.

The people who inspire me now are the same. Sometimes you “rediscover” people because you change. I’m really into Cream now as well as C.C. Deville from Poison. He is absolutely amazing on guitar. I like Tony Iommi and of course, “Uncle” Ted Nugent! As far as blues goes, I like Otis Rush, Luther Allison, Stevie Ray Vaughn, Jimmy Vaughn and B.B. King. I’ve played with guys like Rick Chapman, Automatic Slim, David Earl, Ron Zebron and Pete Kanaras from the Night Hawks. I played with the Night Hawks, it was a memorable experience. Nobody can build a solo like Pete, nobody. He has always inspired me and countless others.

RAY – If you had to define “blues,” how would you do it?

BRIAN – For me, “blues” is defined in a few ways. One – blues is honesty. It’s a release of yor personality, your feelings and your message. Blues has been also defined as “nothin’ but a good man feelin’ bad.” Therefore, blues is upbeat! People that don’t know any better think it’s either boring or glum. Paradoxically it’s the opposite. People are drawn to it. They dance, laugh and enjoy the “non phony-ness” of the experience. Thousands of people who didn’t know what to expect ended up loving it, telling their friends about it.

Playing blues is great because basic parts are rehearsed but the soloing can go on and on. You can do a verse again if you want and it doesn’t have to be perfect. It’s honest. You can’t bullshit your way through a blues gig, it won’t work. You have to respect it, and you have to have lived it to some degree. Blues is the most intricate form of music there is. A lot of great jazz and rock players can’t do it, some find out the hard way. The guitar work in blues is far more elaborate than jazz or rock. You either get it or you don’t.

RAY – Something that seems especially true of blues to me as a listener (and a strictly amateur guitarist) is that it’s a form of music that’s been “handed down” from generation to generation. The innovators, the “big boys” let’s say then, are the ones who can extrapolate from that and make it their own. Zeppelin on their first 2 records comes to mind. Any commentary?

BRIAN – In blues, songs get passed on to others in the present as well as handed down generations. For example, “When The Levee Breaks” was written in the 1930’s by God knows who. But you can hear it by Bob Dylan, Led Zeppelin and countless others. “Hoochie Coochie Man” is another example. Muddy Waters picked it up somewhere. After him, Cream did it, then Clapton alone, Allman Brothers, myself and so on. Back then nothing was copyrighted and nobody was suing anybody over lyrics and music. That started when the radio and music business started airing material and people were making money. But when you play live you can play what you want.

There’s a lot more to it than “originals and covers.” There are 2 sides to a coin but don’t forget the edge. What I mean is, in blues, songs are passed around and handed down as we know. But there’s no rules as far as groove, tempo, key, exact lyrics. One of my songs could last 8 minutes roughly. Then the next night I decide to grab another guitar solo at the end ‘cause it’s feeling great, so now it’s a 12 minute song, but it works. Sometimes I change the key or modulate during the song so the saxophone takes a different tone, then we come back. My band knows how to follow this because of my body language or by signals we use. In blues you have to follow the leader. This comes with experience.

You mentioned Led Zeppelin covering blues material. If you notice the second printings of Zep I and II, you will see Willie Dixon and Robert Johnson got co-writing credits for “Whole Lotta Love,” “I Can’t Quit You,” “You Shook Me” and “Traveling Riverside Blues” (III, I think). These were uncopyrighted songs. However, Willie Dixon stood a good chance in a law suit. Out of legalities and Jimmy Page’s respect, Willie Dixon was paid one million dollars to drop the suit and get co-writing credits from then on. At the time, there was no disrespect to the old bluesmen, the British guitar players were fascinated with what was going on in American blues, which had died off. They put it on the airwaves and gave the world something that will never die. These songs can have stuff added to the recipes for years to come. It never gets old!

RAY – What makes a great blues song?

BRIAN – A great blues song has an honest message. It could be intricate studio work that took days for one song. It could be a basic demo recording that someone got a hold of and passed around. It’s really up to the listener. If you want to take this to another level, I don’t think that people sit around and ponder whether they like it or not. They know right away.

Of course, some players are on a higher level. But when you put together a blues song, you come up with the parts, practice it and it comes out. You want the players to be as good as possible based on the nature of the project, but being honest and doing your best will satisfy you if nobody else.

RAY – You get a day to jam with one of the following players. Who and why? Leslie West, Jimmy Page, Joe Bonamassa or Billy Gibbons?

BRIAN – Obviously I would meet and play with Jimmy Page. I think he’s the greatest ever! He plays a loose style when he plays the blues. None of their live material was ever done the same way twice. You can also hear a little open string buzzing, a bad note or a bass flub. This happens with all bands live if you listen very carefully. It’s also never noticed at big arenas because the crowd is so into it. Page pushed himself live always trying to do better. Led Zeppelin obviously came from the blues before their other varieties of stuff was written. Page is also a great studio player and was a master producer by age 18. He also played guitar on all of Tom Jones’ stuff. He was a session player all during his teens. He is also an artist who was ready to go back to art school and give up music. A few weeks later, he met John Paul Jones and the rest is history.

RAY – Is “Tryin’ To Make A Livin’” your only CD thusfar? Tell me something about how you came to record it, the song selection, all that. It’s quite varied. I could see people into anything from B.B. King to George Thorogood digging it.

BRIAN – No, I also have a live CD and DVD. Both were done on the same night. They were both called “Live At The Shamrock,” recorded Feb 2009.

“Tryin’” came about in early 2003 when I went into the studio to record a few demos. I wanted a few of these songs on the shelf, for no particular reason. A friend and myself laid down some blues without vocals and I agreed something was going on, so I put lyrics to one of the songs. Then I began writing and producing till we started recording. I knew in my head what I wanted and how it was gonna sound, and we accomplished just that. I wrote a variety of songs. There’s a funky tune called “Rockin’ The Boat” which I am proud to say that myself and John Thomakos nailed it on the first shot. I played bass on everything, guitar on everything, drums on 4 tracks, vocals on everything. Ron Zebron played the solo on tracks # 1, #4 and shared solos in #2.

I asked Ron to come in and play the slide solo on “Tryin’ To Make A Livin’” (#1). On that day, I just finished “Days Gone By” (#4). I played everything, finished vocals but the guitar solo wasn’t done yet. He liked it, played along with it, so he did the solo while he was there, why not?! He played electric throughout the song doing fills and the solo. Listen to his chords when the solo goes into the chorus, it’s great! Such dynamics! We worked in his basement studio, me on bass, recording stuff that Never Never (awesome local band) thought about releasing but never did. It was fun none the less, that’s where I got my authentic Jimmy Page licks. Anyway, I had one more song to go, “Whatcha Want Me To Do” (#2). Ron came back to the studio and he and I recorded solos as well as did Mark Cornniachonne, my sax player. (I’ll brag about him in a while!). After that, the mixing, mastering and production came. The graphic arts, credits, lyrics and bio were all printed. Two weeks later, “Tryin’ To Make A Livin’” was done and 1000 copies were in our possession. They sold well at shows, Barnes & Noble, Best Buy, Record And Tape Traders, The Soundgarden, my site and CD (great online store!). It was sold for I-tunes, digital downloading sales and Tower Records. I did well.

You asked about the variance of songs. “Tryin…” was actually a demo one year earlier. It was about the stinkin’ rotten music business and piece of shit bar owners who do not take care of musicians. Like it says in the chorus… “I’ll never give up, I’ll never give in.” “Rockin’ The Boat” was about 2 people in love, for real, who just have a hard time with it, accepting it and making it work. The chorus and ending were inspired by Zeppelin from “Presence.” I could not stand “The Maze,” I think it sucks! But Mark busted his ass getting the riff at the end (which is impossible for most sax players because of the quick change of notes). If you listen, the ending is a mixture of something I wrote, then turns into the riff from Zep’s “Royal Orleans” from “Presence.” “Days Gone By” (#4) is the only song I did not write. It was written and originally recorded by R.C. Yetter (whom I played bass for), the best SRV tribute on the east coast. The fact that my version is a lot slower was an accident, but it sounded great so we kept it.

“Come On Down” (#9) is a polished up instrumental I heard these guys do at a blues jam years earlier. I called it “Come On Down” because during the sax solo we modulate from “C” to “D.” Speaking of which, listen to the saxophone during the solo when the modulation takes place. Awesome! This could never be duplicated by anyone, no way! Mark leaves people stunned and speechless everywhere he plays. As far as the guitar solos, Kurt had me run through 1 or 2 each song and leave it like that. It’s blues, play it like it’s live and leave it. It turned out to sound better than I thought. When you’re playing live, you can’t “do it over.” We stuck to this and it worked.

The CD shows what I do with traditional blues and how I felt it. However, when I play live I do classic rock and blues very aggressive and loud. We play 2 hour sets, sometimes with 10 to 15 minute songs. We go ALL OUT! The live CD and DVD shows it.

RAY – As in the best blues material, you seem to pour your emotions out in the album’s lyrics. Any comments on this, and are any of the songs more special in that regard than others?

BRIAN – Yeah, the lyrics speak of a long relationship I had. “Rockin’ The Boat” was about her and I having a lot of love but maybe not knowing how to deal with it. Love can be nice, but scary to some. Lyrics can seem negative but that doesn’t mean “bad.” You just put down on paper the struggle you have. There was a lot of nice too. “Ain’t No Substitute” means nobody could ever hit my heart of life like her, ever. But “Runnin’ From The Truth” is running from love again, needing to find oneself. Having love but running or resisting might sound hypocritical, but it’s not. It’s quite common but some people aren’t as wonderful as they act. Everybody is scared. “Slow Movin’ Blues” is a Chicago style shuffle which I took the lyrics from a half-written song from years earlier based on an Elmore James song called “Dust My Broom.” The songs have meaning like a lot of blues songs, standard stuff.

RAY – There is a very nice interplay between you and Ron Zebron on the album. Do you prefer working with another guitarist? What are the differences between that scenario and a “power trio” format?

BRIAN – Thank you. Ron and I worked well together. We’re both experienced at studio work and live play. He simply gets right down to it. He listened to the stuff and played with it. Then he recorded it, simple as that. He focuses on his job and is very professional too. He was not in my live band because we are a one guitar band. I tried to get him as a guest but he was always pretty busy. He would be the only guitarist I would have sit in probably. No! I do not work with any guitar player. I tried it but it did not work. I did it in the old days in the blues scence, but with Mark on sax it sounds much better as a second soloist. From time to time, Tom Alonso plays keys and Greg Thompkins sits in on sax. No guitar players and absolutely no fucking harmonica players…stay away!

RAY – Is the line-up that was on “Tryin’…” still intact?

BRIAN – Mark is the only person with me through the studio until now. John was such a busy drummer and teacher, he was hard to get. I played bass on the CD and just about everything else, so I put a rhythm section together once Mark and I picked the date for the CD release party (May 24, 2004). It turned out that Mark and I had a mutual friend in Howard Zizzi. We called him and he’s been playing with us for 5 years. Howard was the drummer for Bootcamp, a big regional band from Baltimore in the 1980’s. They had 2 videos on MTV out of the first 10 they aired. He played in Tiffany for years and worked and works with the Slim Man Jazz Band. Slim Man is also Tim Camp from Bootcamp. Howard is a great drummer, and a great friend, I’m not giving out his number!

Bill Ellinger has been playing bass since 2004. Bill’s a good bass player and also a hard working professional. I called him because he’s the kind of guy who will stick with you and not bail out cause there’s a gig paying $5 more. His bass style is different than mine. He does some great stuff that I never thought of. He and Howard have been playing with me for a long time. We don’t gig a lot these days because the money just isn’t there. We also agreed not to “wear it out,” meaning do so much we get tired of it. It worked, it’s 5 years later and we are still fresh. We all made a good living at one time, but the clubs and bars aren’t paying. We prefer to play in 2 to 3 rooms and do some festivals and bigger stuff in the summer.

Mark Cornniachone is the best sax player ever! He’s played with everybody. Him and I have been playing off each other for years. He helped me get strong and says I helped him do the same. We push each other.

BJ Weigman from Face Dancer and Phoenix Rising plays bass sometimes because Bill plays in an acoustic band also. BJ is a kick ass bassist and great guy. Nice to have him in the family.

RAY – For the gearheads: What kind of guitars/amps/effects did you use on “Tryin…?” How, if at all, does that differ with your live set-up?

BRIAN – I play a Gibson SG & Les Paul. I have a Galveston semi hollow body and the same Mexican Strat I’ve had for 15 years. I play through a Marshall ½ tube, ½ solid state. I don’t know the name of it and don’t care. I used to play whatever amp I could buy or borrow. In the studio, the engineer put me through a few different amps. A “Buddha,” A Fender somethin’ or another. I used to use a TS-9 tube screamer till the guy wanted it back. Pedals are for pussies. Gearheads are annoying. As you can tell, I don’t care what I play through. I don’t hide behind equipment. I played in the blues scene and was dirt poor and lived it. I played through whatever I had. Guys borrowed a lot from each other in those days. We played for peanuts, slept in vans, on pool tables, ate sandwiches, whatever it took. I learned how to play and not hide like a gearhead pussy. I don’t know what kind of pick-ups I have and don’t care. The bottom line is money and broads. It’s all about money. Gearheads, if you come to a show, please do not talk to me.

RAY – Speaking of gear and broads (ha ha): You’re offered A) a vintage Strat signed by Stevie Ray V or B) an all-night date with Angelina Jolie. Which do you choose and why?

BRIAN – You’ve got to be joking! I’d take a vintage SRV-signed Strat any day of the week over Angelina Jolie! She’s funny-looking and has a big head. She also looks like her father, that’s scary! There’s plenty of chicks with big lips in town if that’s your thing.

RAY – Do women prefer blues or rock guitarists?

BRIAN – Smart women like both.

RAY – I noticed you thank Never Never on the CD. Great band! Have you jammed with them in the past? Do you still?

BRIAN – I’ve sat in from time to time. I learned a bunch of material because I wanted to play bass for them when Angelo quit. The position was filled quickly. We have talked to Spike about doing a blues gig with us every 6 or 7 weeks as a side project. He would like to, it’s just a matter of scheduling. It’s going to be called “Brian Tingle’s All Star Blues Band, featuring ‘whoever.’” I really want this to happen. Ron was fun to work with as well as John Thomakos. Great guys.

RAY – How has “Tryin’…” sold, have you gotten a lot of copies out there?

BRIAN – It sold well. It sold in stores ok. Where it really sold was on CD Baby. It’s an online record store that sells everything from A to Z. It was a great deal because it cost me $ 35. My album will be in stock forever, no more fees. People from all over the world bought it. Belgium, London, Australia, Holland, Germany, etc. It was interesting to get emails from someone on the other side of the Atlantic.

RAY – With that in mind, what do you think of the current internet marketing of music…that is to say, artists beginning to not actually release a physical album but just having people download the music online? Are you old-school on this and prefer actually “holding an album in your hand” or do you figure, whatever it takes to get the music out there?

BRIAN – Interesting question. First of all, no choice but to operate in this business according to the way it has become. Downloading quickly off the internet is convenient. It is easy to obtain anything you want for the most part. With that aside, I think the music business has gone down the toilet. Downloading has ruined the business completely. I know that people are legitimately making money but the integrity is gone. I’m definitely old-school when it comes to recording and marketing.

Years ago, we hand-made our own fliers, put them up in clubs and colleges. We saved dimes to make demos and copies of them. We earned money to buy strings and equipment and we had to fix it ourselves if it broke. We played in barns and promoted it for weeks. We would camp out the Hecht Co. for Kiss tickets that went on sale the next morning. I remember the “Destroyer” album coming out in December of 1976 and having to wait until Christmas morning to open it. (That was me with “Zep IV” a few years earlier. R.D.). We looked forward to these things and worked hard to get them. It was an event to go to the store for the latest Led Zeppelin album…get it home and put it on the record player! Back then we really had to work hard to learn these songs because there were no remotes or no way to slow the record down to catch the notes. Basically, kids worked harder to obtain instruments, learned how to play them. We also had to work harder to do things like book reports, other school stuff. I remember having to walk every night in the snow to the library to finish a book report. Now, all you have to do is pull up info on the internet and you are done. So whether you are talking about learning how to play and respect music or living life, kids today are just stupid for the most part and don’t stand a chance in life.

I understand that karaoke is fun for people who don’t get a chance to let it out in public, or just have fun. It’s also there for amateurs to have fun. It’s kind of fun to watch, cause drunks get up there and make total fools of themselves. Meanwhile, the guy who owns the machine is making $ 2 a song. Money, bottom line. It did cut into live music because it’s easier to deal with one guy than a band and cheaper. Guitar Hero, on the other hand, is really cool….for the people who made it and the band cashing in on it. But it’s just another way parents spend money on their kids to help them become more stupid, staring at another screen. Some of them think they are actually playing. Amazing. It takes away from reality when it comes to learning a craft like playing an instrument. This game is fun for some, I’m sure. Not all have the ability to play for real, but learning how to play at all levels is a joy. All this fantasy stuff is killing the music business like we once knew it.

I hear some new artists from time to time. Some of it is ok but very boring and repetitive. You can tell there isn’t much collaboration. The day of the great guitarist is over. There will never be another Jimmy Page or Eric Clapton. I really don’t know where rock & roll is going. Rap and hip hop is garbage, there’s no talent in running your mouth and wearing gold like you just walked out of a jail yard. I can’t wait till that shit is dry. I pray for the music business.

RAY – What kind of blues scene is there in the Baltimore (and Maryland) area? How much do you gig? How far outside the local area have you played?

BRIAN – As for the local blues/music scene I would have to say that Baltimore is one of the most unfriendly scenes anywhere. Bands don’t get paid shit. Some have fun, have their friends out but don’t get what they deserve. When you’re young it’s ok. But it gets old. I came in when things were ok. Club owners paid you what they agreed to. Bands could get a few drinks and food, sometimes, for free. After all, you are keeping people in the room, keeping them drinking, which is the bottom line. It’s only about money. Bands are respected. Nowadays, you can’t get paid much. Half the time they try to cheat you at the end of the night. “It wasn’t as good a night as I thought” (standard bullshit line). Whatever you accept is all you will ever get! Owners and bar managers want to turn down, play a variety, start early, end late, want you to pay for your drinks, get cheated at the end of the night. I know there’s still nice places to play but this is happening more and more. Music is supposed to be played LOUD, by the way. If you want to talk while we are playing, go to Starbucks or learn how to read lips!

I don’t gig much these days. It isn’t paying a band much money. We all have to work other jobs. We have about 2 rooms to play regularly and special occasions like outdoor stuff and joint projects like some double and triple bills, like I have in the works with Face Dancer, The Ravyns and Kix (awesome band…R.D.) (Not definite yet, waiting for details).

I have played in more clubs and events that I can remember, honest. Whether it was my band or as bassist with R.C. Yetter, or some blues band. I have played all over Pennsylvania (Pittsburgh, Allentown, York, Red Lion, Dallastown, Reading, Harrisburg, Lewistown, Mifflintown, Carlisle, Mechanicsburg, New Bloomfield, Dillsburg, Hanover, Gettysburg, Pottsville). All over New Jersey, D.C., Virginia, North Carolina, Orlando, Key West, Miami, Sarasota, Tampa, Alabama and back up the coast. I’ve played for a couple at the Full Moon Saloon, a thousand at the old Hammerjacks, 14,000 at the Orlando Civic Arena and 40,000 people at Tampa Stadium. I played a few hundred clubs, festivals, up to 250 nights in a year. I’m tired.

All you find playing in a lot of places now are goofs who call themselves “artists.” That’s just another word for “bum.” They think their material has integrity and meaning, what a laugh. Club owners like them because they don’t get paid. I’m not an artist, I’m an entertainer and have the history to back it up. I don’t hang around with musicians or “artists” (aka bums). I like to play, have fun, etc. But to all club owners who are screwing musicians: Fuck you! Artists, leave me alone.

RAY – What are your future plans for your music? Any new recordings in the pipeline? Live shows I should know about?

BRIAN – I have a few things in the works with other bands and prospects. I’ve been approached by a promoter to do some stuff at Merriweather, Pier Six and Nissan Pavillion next year as an opener. All this, I’d love to do, of course. I want to play gigs once a month and a private party once in awhile. Other than that, I lay low. There’s no money, for the most part. I might retire to the Eastern Shore in a few years. I might go back to playing a few nights a week in the Delaware, Dewey, Fenwick and Ocean City area clubs that deserveth me. Yes, I will be recording. What, I don’t know. I’m doing a special birthday gig/party at The Shamrock Inn on Harford Road (Baltimore) September 18.

RAY – In your history as a musician, tell us some story from either the studio, live scene, etc. that is either uproariously funny, wildly obscene or just plain ridiculous. Anything goes.

BRIAN – The first one I can think of was when I was drumming for R.C. Yetter. We were in Harrisburg, playing at the huge biker commune owned by Abate. There were people all over the place. We were playing on this big porch. Anyway, there were people all around us. I look up and saw this huge guy, about 6 foot 5. He had this small head with a mullet haircut, long in the back. His shoulders drooped way down low and he had no neck. His shoulders were narrow, he had a big stomach. Below his waist tapered down to his feet. His shoes were small. HE LOOKED JUST LIKE FOGHORN LEGHORN!!! I’m sorry, but I lost it. I signaled our bass player, Dave. I point it out (subtly), I couldn’t stop laughing, thinking about the cartoon. All I could hear was “I said, I said, I said…” I was waiting for the weasel to come around to the side. I mean, I was laughing so hard I almost threw up. Plus I was afraid he’d see me. This guy could have crushed me. I know it wasn’t real nice but I don’t care, you gotta find something to do while you’re on the road. I don’t know why the “Foghorn” story came to mind, but it did. I’ve seen all kinds of stuff though. Too much to write.

RAY – Any final comments?

BRIAN – Thank you very much for thinking of me. Good luck with your website.

It’s great to do an interview, especially with an artist who has such a history in the local scene as BRIAN TINGLE and then to have him speak at length with such candor as he does here. I can only highly recommend his discs and urge you, as I plan on doing, to check him out live as soon as possible.

NOTE: BRIAN also has a live CD and DVD available, recorded earlier in 2009 and he’s got the following cool deals on ‘em all:
“Tryin’ To Make A Livin’” CD $ 15.00 + $ 2.00 shipping & handling
“Live At Shamrock” CD $ 10.00 + $ 2.00 s&h
“Live At Shamrock” DVD $ 10.00 + $ 2.00 s&h
“Live At Shamrock” CD & DVD $15.00 + $ 2.00 s&h
Call Alex (producer) 443-743-0329
Or Brian 443-983-5920

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